An indie comic mini rant

[bluemeanie]

Is anyone else pissed off with the whole Kickstarter mentality with comics now?

I have HUGE respect for the guys you see at cons each and every time, sat at their table, pushing their photocopied comics or their mini runs of Ka-Blam printed stuff. Putting out an issue every 6 months, working towards a hopeful collection at the end.

The norm now seems to be

"Hello, I want to publish a 5 part book... can everyone donate money so I can?"

The number of Kickstarter links I've checked which are small press guys looking for £2000 for a colour hardback run of something which to be honest doesnt deserve a colour hardback run. And no, £20 for your 25 page comic isnt worth it even if you do print my name on a thank you page at the end.

DO IT PROPERLY. Put out issue one, use any cash from that to pay for issue two


GAAAH!!

rant over... or paused

[locustsofdeath!]

I agree with you on this. I like the DIY mentality myself, and have actually started putting together my own series which will hopefully be published quarterly...if I can find an artist/artists up for the challenge!

It's seemingly a shot in the dark, but it happens - look at the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Cerebus and a few others. Of course the risk for the creators is nil when the money of others is involved - so I see why these guys are giving this a shot - but with the sheer amount of donation requesting going on having other produce their book AND having it become popular almost seems to make all the odds longer.

This type of thing is so much worse in the independent film world, though. I'm poor as shite myself but have these bastards ask me for cash (no matter how big or small)!

[The Cosh]

Kickstart. That's the one with the motorbikes?

[Bolt-01]

Amen, brother.

[bluemeanie]

Just got sent another one which is basically saying
"We're almost there for our goal to put out issue one... we've got $3200 of our $3600 goal"

WHAT THE FUCK??

First comic thing I did. Baby Boomers for Orang Utan comics.
Dumb little comic that they said they wanted to publish then turned out to be a "If you guys pay to get it printed"
Cost me about £100 from memory for my share of a print run of about 100.
Got a few quid of it back but no more than £20 or so. God knows if they still have the rest or if they invested it into other stuff and not bothered if they did. Was worth it to have a comic done. Plus it subsequently got picked up by Markosia so consider it some dues paid.

But regardless... Ka-Blam. Full colour 28 page comic costs $2.83 a copy to print.
No indie creators should be doing more than 100 or at MOST 200 at a time, I dont care who they fucking think they are.
So if 200, whats that... $566? And again thats full colour. Indies are generally black and white.

You want to put your book out there. If you think its worth it. PAY FOR THE FUCKING THING.
Why should others subsidise your fucking hobby?

For full disclosure I should say I DID have a story in a Kickstarter funded book but this was a "Donate 10 and get a copy of the full graphic novel" deal and was also for the Comic Book Legal Defense Fund, so can justify the charity status a little bit more

[CrazyFoxMachine]

If it's anything to this discussion at all this is the first I've heard of it -

I thought there was nothing other method than the one I'm chosing to go with this year

fund it myself and make an absolute massive loss for the love of the thing.

The idea of begging is outrageous - I'd happily spend every penny of my money even if it meant I got nothing in return but a arsekicking comic I'd helped make.

[stacey]

Amen, brother.

Bolt is very wise. So, what he said!

[COMMANDO FORCES]

Amen, brother.

And sister!

[Minkyboy]

Kickstart. That's the one with the motorbikes?

Doo doo doo dooby dooby doo doo dooby doo

[NeilFord]

Interesting opinions, I don't see the problem myself, you dont have to pledge any money, exactly the same as you don't have to buy a comic from an independant creator at a conference.

In fact, if done in a creative fashion, I think it is a smart way of pre-selling original art & collectables. Have you seen what Kody Chanberlin did for Sweets? http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/sweets/sweets-by-kody-chamberlain and http://kodychamberlain.blogspot.com/

I think what he did was very clever, it ain't 'begging' that's for sure.

What exactly annoys you about it so much?

[pauljholden]

I'm fighting with Neil Ford camp, I'm afraid.

If you don't like it, don't support it, it's easier to not support than it is to support.

There is NO virtue is losing money on self publishing comics (ESPECIALLY if your entire income is derived from writing/drawing comics - then losing money on self publishing means actually not having money to pay for food).

Yeah, as more people cotton on there's gonna be more and more crap made available via it - but you simply don't support that stuff and support the stuff that looks good.

-pj

[bluemeanie]

Well the basic pre-pay ones arent the ones that piss me off
Many are "Pledge three quid and you get a copy"... which is essentially what you do if you order anything out of Previews anyway.

But the "Give me twenty quid" thing is bullshit. Its like me saying "I'd like to be a racing car driver... can you all pay for me to have one of those £500 Grand Prix days"
Why the hell should anyone?

I just dont see why someone needs over a grand to put out a single issue of their comic and why they should expect anyone else to foot the bill. Especially when I get at least 2 or 3 of these every day on Facebook/Twitter/Email at the moment.
If you are struggling to print your 50 black and whites to take to a con, then ok. If you cant quite afford those deluxe editions straight off, how about working up to them?

[Emperor]

I'm with Neil Ford and PJ Holden Block on this, it is a very handy way of doing something like allowing people to pre-pay for say a trade paperback collection and this then helps offset any production costs.

It'd also be quite a good way to get a creator-owned comic off the ground because if you are aiming for top quality then you might need some cash up front to keep the project moving - see for example, Phonogram and Gutsville.

Granted the bigger donations might seem a stretch but again, you aren't making anyone pay this, if what you get in return is worth it (and that is a personal call) then it might be worth your while.

The worry is, everyone with a hole in their arse now thinks this is an easy way to get a comic done, which they can then get optioned for a movie and they are set for life. This has led to a lot of people being rubbed up the wrong way by repeated requests to give and in the end an awful lot of people end up not giving to anything (plus some forums might feel it is banworthy if you sign up to shout "gimme cash").

[Jimmy Baker's Assistant]

I have done a bit of small press comic publishing and indeed the aim is to collect the strips into a trade or two. However I won't be asking for your money in advance, not now or ever.

I do obviously want your money, but I'll do the decent thing and wait to have something to exchange it for.

Oh and I won't spam you even then, which may possibly be the real source of the aggravation here.

[bluemeanie]

Well its partially the spam, but lets be honest most of the internet is

Its more the amount. All these people could self fund a run of 100. I dont see why they cant do that. Nobody needs over a grand to put out an issue one. Especially as most are small press types anyway, not name creators... even if some seem to think they are.