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The Political Thread

Started by The Legendary Shark, 09 April, 2010, 03:59:03 PM

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Tjm86

Quote from: JPMaybe on 29 June, 2016, 06:25:38 PM
I didn't think I could be any more convinced of the utter and total disdain in which the PLP hold their members;

I've got to admit to being in a real bind on this one as a Labour party member (long before Corbyn took over).  On the one hand he was, to my mind, the most credible candidate in terms of representing Social Democratic ideas.  On the other hand we now have a parliamentary party that seems more concerned with internecine rivalry than they do with challenging the complete and utter balls up that culminated in last week. 

Is it time to sensibly suggest that actually we need to recognise that although we don't agree completely with the PLP, we have to accept that they have to have a leader in the House that they can work with?  I'm not completely sold on this score since I do feel that there needs to be a recognition that they are 'representatives' which seems to have been a little lost along the way.  That said there needs to be a middle ground found.  It's not easy since this problem is pretty much guaranteed to hand over the next election to the Tories who will continue their scorched earth policy with regards to the British state.

JPMaybe

My favoured solution is a negotiated resignation, with a left candidate guaranteed to go on the leadership ballot against whoever the third-wayers chuck up.  OF course, as with Corbyn himself, said candidate would probably walk  the resulting election, hence why the backstabbers haven't suggested it.
Quote from: Butch on 17 January, 2015, 04:47:33 PM
Judge Death is a serial killer who got turned into a zombie when he met two witches in the woods one day...Judge Death is his real name.
-Butch on Judge Death's powers of helmet generation

James Dilworth

Is invoking Godwin's Law an invocation of Godwin's Law?

Oh my goodness.  It's Hitlers all the way down, isn't it?


Hawkmumbler

Quote from: James Dilworth on 29 June, 2016, 09:24:05 PM
Is invoking Godwin's Law an invocation of Godwin's Law?

Oh my goodness.  It's Hitlers all the way down, isn't it?


Invoking it the second anyone brings up modern far right politics in relation to the Nazi party is, yes.

It's basically the same as saying "Wel I support UKIP and i'm not a racist! Look, I have ONE black friend to prove that!".

James Dilworth


Professor Bear

Quote from: JPMaybe on 29 June, 2016, 06:25:38 PMI've come round to the view, rather painfully,  that Corbyn doesn't have the competence to push his agenda, but there's no way in hell now I'm not voting him straight back in given the scumminess of his opponents.

It's worth remembering that Corbyn's plan was always to bugger off in 2018 and hand the reins over to a party moderate, so what gets me about this laughably ineffective coup is: one of the most singularly stubborn bastards in Parliament, with three decades of digging his heels in even if it ruins him to do so, and they try to bully him into submission when he's made no secret of the fact that he doesn't even want the fucking job.
I honestly cannot fathom how this was expected to pan out.  Even if Corbyn went willingly - and he was never going to do that - the party membership would have gone apeshit and the recent converts and union support would have been in the wind.  The party would have been Labour in name only, defunded, mistrusted, and with zero credibility, and that's ignoring events outside the party like the rise of far-right sentiment and racist attacks that have come about in the wake of the country lacking a sense of unity that could have been countered by at least one of the main parties trying to reach out.

What a bunch of useless, blinkered, selfish cunts.

Banners

Seen politicians lose and resign, but to win the referendum and not step up to deal with the consequences? Shocking. Did Boris Johnson not want to leave the EU after all?

8-Ball

Quote from: Banners on 30 June, 2016, 11:58:19 AM
Seen politicians lose and resign, but to win the referendum and not step up to deal with the consequences? Shocking. Did Boris Johnson not want to leave the EU after all?

That's the problem. The Remain side thought they couldn't lose (and therefore didn't plan for it) and the Leave side thought they wouldn't win (and therefore didn't plan for it). It's now clear that Johnson and Gove thought that they could scrape a narrow loss (51% Remain/49% Leave) that they could use to undermine and depose Cameron and scare the EU into greater reforms on the free movement of people. The only people who genuinely wanted to leave were that shower of shits UKIP.
Whatever happened to Rico, Dolman and Cadet Paris? I'm sooo out of the loop.

ZenArcade

Probably right 8 Ball, that still leaves us with a problem:  how on earth have we came to the pass, whereby the Political class are so removed that they will consider the people's safety both physical and economic; the integrity of the union between the nations and the status of the country internationally, as simple collateral in an internecine party feud?  Z  >:( >:(
Ed is dead, baby Ed is...Ed is dead

TordelBack

#10524
Quote from: Banners on 30 June, 2016, 11:58:19 AM
Did Boris Johnson not want to leave the EU after all?

Well nothing he'd said prior to March this year would have given the impression that he did. Perhaps he's just exercising his EU-mandated 14 day cooling-off period?

And yes, it is both disgusting, revealing and unsurprising that politicians see everything they claim to value as subordinate to their own career/financial interest.  And those that are burdened with actual principles and a complex perspective on complex questions are 'unelectable'.  Journalism and news media should be tasked with exposing this hypocrisy, rather than parroting the rabble-rousing lies of their chosen side.

NapalmKev

Quote from: ZenArcade on 30 June, 2016, 12:51:42 PM
Probably right 8 Ball, that still leaves us with a problem:  how on earth have we came to the pass, whereby the Political class are so removed that they will consider the people's safety both physical and economic; the integrity of the union between the nations and the status of the country internationally, as simple collateral in an internecine party feud?  Z  >:( >:(

The claw hammer solution sounds more palatable as the days drag on! Either that or we elect some real-life Humans into power, and sack the private-school mob who seem to be living in the Nineteenth Century.

Cheers
"Where once you fought to stop the trap from closing...Now you lay the bait!"

Banners

Johnson goaded people into voting Leave...

QuoteYou were about to strike your own small but vital blow for freedom and democracy – when you suddenly bottled it. You swerved; you shied; you jibbed; you baulked.

...and then "bottled it" himself.

IndigoPrime

Theresa May now effectively saying EU residents will be a bargaining chip in negotiations. So we now have a Conservative going beyond what even Farage wanted to happen. Marvellous. (And God knows what this would mean for all the Irish over here. How the CTA is to be affected, no-one has any idea.)

I want to stay in the UK less and less with every passing day.

sheridan

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 30 June, 2016, 04:30:17 PM
Theresa May now effectively saying EU residents will be a bargaining chip in negotiations. So we now have a Conservative going beyond what even Farage wanted to happen. Marvellous. (And God knows what this would mean for all the Irish over here. How the CTA is to be affected, no-one has any idea.)

I want to stay in the UK less and less with every passing day.
I've always wanted the UK to stay united, having English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish ancestors in living memory.  This year for the first time ever I've come to think that if Scotland or Northern Ireland left the union my main thought would be 'good luck to you who have departed'.

8-Ball

Quote from: ZenArcade on 30 June, 2016, 12:51:42 PM
Probably right 8 Ball, that still leaves us with a problem:  how on earth have we came to the pass, whereby the Political class are so removed that they will consider the people's safety both physical and economic; the integrity of the union between the nations and the status of the country internationally, as simple collateral in an internecine party feud?  Z  >:( >:(

Like most people, I have no idea, Z. All I do know is that right now our country has been hijacked by opportunists, egotists and xenophobes and I don't know how we get it back. :o
Whatever happened to Rico, Dolman and Cadet Paris? I'm sooo out of the loop.