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Prog 1992: The Dunwich Horror!

Started by Eamonn Clarke, 30 July, 2016, 02:05:47 PM

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Frank


Thanks!

I was thinking of the wrong podcast and misunderstood what Reppion meant. He describes their system as "a production line, where one person does one bit and then it gets handed over to the other person", but Moore says that means he plots the episode, then she breaks that down into panel layouts:

https://soundcloud.com/2000-ad/the-2000-ad-thrill-cast-10-june-2015#t=42:20



TordelBack

Quote from: mejustnow on 04 August, 2016, 02:22:14 PM
Quote from: Butch on 04 August, 2016, 01:27:54 PM

It would have been great if the end of this book had been the only partially seen chronicler of the Black Shuck mythos putting down his real ale and battered paperback, turning to the camera, and announcing 'I know all this is true, for it is I, Black Shuck, and I live yet still!'.


This is EXACTLY what I thought was going to happen.

Me too. I even thought 'ah, so that's what that endless folklore lesson in its ghastly typeface was about'. But it was not to be. I've been pretty hard on Black Shuck for most of its run but it's actually won me over. Moore and Reppion have a serious problem with structuring a story in such small chunks, and it's hurt the flow of this series since the start, giving the impression of just one unconnected thing after another, or in my perdonalmcase, page after leaden page of excerpts from Suffolk Folklore dragging the thing to a weekly standstill. Taken as a whole it's a good brisk read - but week to week it's a mess. I can't agree with Butch about the indistinguishable bearded characters, and I don't believe such sn attentive reader was confused for a second. Despite reservations about the historical set dressing this is Yeowell's best work in ages, and minimalist characterisation of large casts is his forte.

If Moore and Reppion can tackle the episodic structure, I'd love to see this back. As it is, running against Wagner and Abnett in the same Prog, it sticks out like a hairy paw.

Trout

I think you're all being a bit too tough on Black Shuck. I see it as a good adventure story with lots of teeth, swords, punching and mythology, and I'm hoping it really does come back.

Link Prime

Quote from: Butch on 04 August, 2016, 01:27:54 PM
if I don't like something I generally tend not to mention it at all.

It's a good policy to have I think (not that there are too many stories that fail to radiate Thrill-Power).

Regretfully, I'm also not much of fan of Black Shuck (despite thinking that the 'Outlander with a Werewolf' set-up in the first story was quite good).
Although it had some nice touches (the framing sequence in particular), I found the second story difficult to follow, and what I did grasp wasn't my cup of mead.

The nail in the coffin, however, was the artwork.
Like most of us, I rate Steve Yeowell very, very highly- he's produced some incomparable work for 2000AD. I'm an unreserved fan, and am lucky enough to have purchased some original artwork from the man himself.
Similarly, Chris Blythe is a brilliant colorist- the computer coloring bar was raised when he was constructed in the late 90's.

Why then, do I find the Yeowell / Blythe combination so unappealing? It could be that Yeowell's modern 'looser' style doesn't lend well to computer coloring. It could simply be that he's always at his best in black & white to my mind.
Recently, on DeMarco PI in the Megazine, some of Yeowell's work was in B&W and heavily inked by Lee Townsend. I found that worked really, really well with his current style.
As we no doubt have many more years of artwork from the Yeowell Droid to look forward to, it's something I hope to see more of.

Link Prime

Sorry for the double post, but I found some examples of Black (and White) Shuck on this very website; http://www.2000adonline.com/post/465

That's more my cuppa.

TordelBack

Quote from: Link Prime on 05 August, 2016, 11:25:47 AM
Why then, do I find the Yeowell / Blythe combination so unappealing? I

I generally dislike Blythe's colours on the more open linework style of people like Willshire and Yeowell, but in Black Shuck I think it actually works. That said, I also hugely admire Yeowell's spare lines and the huge vistas and bright sunlight they create in B&W, something used to great effect on Red Seas (although Yeowell colouring himself has been a bit of a dogs dinner, I'm afraid). I think that he treads such a fine line in minimalism that sometimes he missteps - the recent DeMarco story, for example, I felt suffered from too little information in the art - and I suspect the obviously hard work Blythe puts in on BS is something of a buffer against this possibility, and together they have produced some of their best work of recent years. Plus an eye to future repackaging in less B&W-friendly markets.

I agree with our piscine King-over-the-Water, BS is the kind of British sword and sorcery strip that I would have devoured in my youth, despite it's rather too serious delivery, and it's a welcome addition to the roster. I still feel the episodic pacing lets it down, but that won't harm it all in collection.

TordelBack

Gag! Are we ever going to be allowed edit on the review threads? Autocorrect is making me cry.

Frank

Quote from: Tordelback on 05 August, 2016, 01:40:03 PM
Quote from: Link Prime on 05 August, 2016, 11:25:47 AM
I found some examples of Black (and White) Shuck on this very website; http://www.2000adonline.com/post/465  That's more my cuppa.

... the recent DeMarco story, for example, I felt suffered from too little information in the art - and I suspect the obviously hard work Blythe puts in on BS is something of a buffer against this possibility

Those pages are beautiful, Link.

One of my earliest posts on this board was a typically lengthy defence of Yeowell's genius: long story short, the bits he leaves out force your imagination to engage and fill in the rest, in a way that will work better for you (you, personally) than a thousand lines of cross hatching or gradient fills.

I agree with Tordelback that Blythe has done his usual sterling work on Shuck, with the caveat that anyone colouring Yeowell is on a hiding to nothing. He's developed a style specifically tailored to work in mono; I'd argue that the imposition of colour actively detracts from its magnificence.

As TB says, Shuck seems a likely candidate for the US limited series/TPB treatment*, so the decision to colour it is sound.


* although things seem to have gone quiet on that front, lately

Jim_Campbell

I find myself wondering if Yeowell's art wouldn't benefit from a far less rendered colouring style. As noted already, The Owl leaves those big white spaces open for a reason and filling them with texture and brushwork seems to actively working against his intent. I find myself wondering what his work would look like coloured more in the vein of Dave Stewart's Hellboy colouring style, which lays down vast slabs of flat colour and relies instead on a meticulously-chosen palette to compliment the art.

(Not a criticism of Blythe, BTW, who has, over the years, routinely raised the bar for digital colouring.)
Stupidly Busy Letterer: Samples. | Blog
Less-Awesome-Artist: Scribbles.

TordelBack

I appreciate the nuance in your Dave-Stewartish idea Jim, but the basic concept sounds very like how Yeowell colours his own work, or D'Israeli's work on Devlin Waugh - or even a bit like Gina Hart's work (?) on Zenith Phase IV (and we're still giving out about that one, not that there's anything wrong with the job itself). 

Yeowell is essentially a B&W artist, and when his stuff works it's unique and almost peerless.   Given that, I think the tension between Blythe's "raster" style (filling every millimetre with graded colour aimed at creating surface and volume) and Yeowell's "vector" style (creating forms and space through lines and solid blocks of white and black) does create something new and worthwhile in its own right.  Certainly a major step up from their early collaboration on hardwood-texture-fancier's dream Red Fang.   

maryanddavid

Brink, a really outstanding new series, claustrophobic setting and sparse art that really suits the tone.
Ideally this returns for another 15 episode book and wraps.

Its one of the faults of the newer generation of strips in 2000AD that are story led rather that Character led, they can tend to ramble a little with too log a gap between 'books'.  Brass Sun is a perfect example of this, fantastic first outing, great art, interesting set up and a strong lead. The it meanders. Still interesting and a decent read, but it could all be a little bit tighter and a great read.

Anyhow, the return of Outlier was a surprise, third time lucky, so far so good.

Dredd, W&E, 'Nuff Said.

Scarlet Traces, I&D 'Nuff Said, Blue Venusians, nice Dare touch.

Black Shuck, parts of this I enjoyed, but overall it didnt work, mainly because it wasn't clear. I really enjoyed the first series, so I'd give this a cautious thumbs up for a third outing.


Dan Banks

Quote from: petesbeats on 04 August, 2016, 02:06:57 PM
I may be a sucker for punishment but I've just reread Black Shuck and it made far more sense in one sitting.  I still had no idea who the person that turned into the one eyed wolf was though?  Can anyone enlighten me?  I wasn't sure if it was someone from the first arc or not?

Cheers

I've just done a reread of this myself and I think the implication is that he's Black Shuck's real father, which makes a lot more genetic sense than Blonde King Ivar from the first story I suppose.

This also explains why Black Shuck can control his wolfy-bearness unlike his Viking mate who got a scratch from Grendel in book one, Black Shuck has always been half Scucca.

As has been mentioned already though, I'm not 100% on this as it's so unclear. The Scucca character comes out of nowhere, scuppers Black Shucks plans and then dies without really telling us much at all.

However, is that the idea? The whole point of the history lesson narration is to tell us that hardly anything is known about this period of Anglian history so the writers give us a few suggestive "facts" and let us put together our own theories.

After a full re-read of both series, I still need to take another pass at them!

I'd still like to see another series anyway, just to get a little pay off from the series 1 cliffhanger!

A.Cow

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 05 August, 2016, 06:42:00 PM
(Not a criticism of Blythe, BTW, who has, over the years, routinely raised the bar for digital colouring.)

That's so true.  I was re-reading Luna-1 zombie Dredd story Darkside recently and found the heavy gradient-fill distracting & overpowering.  It's easy to forget how far the art of digital colouring has moved in 20 years, thanks to people like Chris Blythe.

Quote from: Tordelback on 06 August, 2016, 12:09:02 AM
Certainly a major step up from their early collaboration on hardwood-texture-fancier's dream Red Fang.

I still get aroused thinking about those well-polished tables.  Mmmmm.

Colin YNWA

Late to the party. Sorry

Normally with two ending in the prog there's much to think about, not so today. See Black Shuck lost me a while ago and I saw this cut and thrust high tempo conclusion and wondered now we got here. One to judge on re-read (on a side note I discussed before my love for the Mighty Yeowell's bold use of white so agree with comments below, if you choice to colour him do it as simply as possible). The other ending isn't really a  ending now is it. I've loved Blink from the off but here it has its first mis-step. I shouldn't complain as it promise more of this glorious series but it pretty unsatisfying. I almost wanted this to be a done in one story, would have really suited it tight claustrophobic tone, but couldn't see how it was going to do that...and it didn't. All we got was a summary of what we'd seen to date and a new twisty cliffhanger thing. Still we're getting g more and it has been sublime so it's churlish to complain.

Elsewhere we're on tip for Dredd, well I saw her coming in that panel but still this is two masters at work, I may have read it before but when it's this good who cares. Outlier continueso to build supremely and Scarlet Traces has a fantastic interlude.

Good progage ... followed quickly by...

Frank

Quote from: Dan Banks on 06 August, 2016, 08:09:45 AM
I think the implication is that (the Scucca) is Black Shuck's real father, which makes a lot more genetic sense than Blonde King Ivar from the first story I suppose.

This also explains why Black Shuck can control his wolfy-bearness unlike his Viking mate who got a scratch from Grendel in book one, Black Shuck has always been half Scucca.

As has been mentioned already though, I'm not 100% on this as it's so unclear. The Scucca character comes out of nowhere, scuppers Black Shucks plans and then dies without really telling us much at all.


That would have been interesting, but - as with King Ivar* - if that was Shuck meeting his dad, it didn't really amount to much dramatically. And if that was the authors' intention, you would have thought one of the characters would at least have acknowledged the Oedipal nature of the encounter.

The Scucca's motivation for sending the note that grassed Shuck up to King Aerowulf (and why he seems certain Shuck's kids are Scucca) fly by with similarly scant attention. The Scucca just seems to have it in for Shuck because he's the villain and Shuck's the good guy, and bad guys don't like heroes.

Whether Shuck's always been a doggy (and why he doesn't want his twins to be pups) doesn't get any clearer on a reread. We get one line - if there had only been one (foetus), maybe ... - and the idea that drinking werewolf blood in Book 1 activated something long dormant seems like a retcon.

Nothing about Black Shuck's terrible ... it's just nothing seems to carry any dramatic weight. Motivation and characterisation are skipped over so lightly that it's difficult to care whether anyone lives or dies, or why it would be so terrible if Dunwich became part of Mercia anyway.

That's why it's so difficult to remember who characters are, or what happened last week. People, dialogue, and events skim lightly over the reader's consciousness without disturbance, like a well aimed stone over a still pond. It would be an impressive skill, if it was deliberate.


* In Book 1, the Dene who ends up biting Shuck tells him he knew Shuck was the bastard son of Ivar (who they'd been sent to retrieve) as soon as he set eyes on him. If he isn't Shuck Ivarson, why was Bitey Wolfskinson so certain of his paternity?