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Christmas Day Doctor Who: Should I Watch It?

Started by Adrian Bamforth, 23 December, 2005, 08:00:49 AM

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Adrian Bamforth

It seems the BBC are set on letting Russell T Davies continue writing Doctor Who episodes - the question is, it's difficult to ignore so should I try and get into the spirit of it and watch the Christmas day episode or avoid like the plague? YOU DECIDE!

One complaint I have is of course that none of it (written by Davies) makes any sense - I thought that perhaps if anyone could explain these plot points (I didn't see all the episodes) I might be persuaded to give it another go, or at least go a bit easier on it in future (obviously, I didn't watch it avidly so I may be missing some things through my own volition):

As I recall after cheerily showing Rose the destruction of her home planet, The Doctor has the audacity to complain that his own race, the Time Lords (I'm not sure I recall them being refered to as a race before, surely it's an more an occupation? Isn't his race Gallifreyian?) were wiped out (except for him) during a 'Time War' (whatever that is). Now, surely you can't wipe out Time Lords in a war since by nature they are all over the place in time. And even so, why should The Doctor be so unhappy, since he can simply go back in time and live with them again? All races will become extinct or diluted in time. In fact if he's in the future everyone he knows is already dead anyway.

We find later that the enemy that wiped out the Time Lords was...drum roll...the Daleks! Though a few episodes ago there was only one of THEM, left in a museum, now there's millions of them.

Didn't the Dalek Invasion of Earth follow the collapse of cililisation brought about by the end of a TV news channel, or the proliferation or Reality TV or something? How did that work then?

Does The Doctor actually LIKE The Earth? In one episode he describes it as something of an insignificant backwater planet yet he hardly left it for the first series and he adores the work of Dickens.

Those aliens who keep invading Cardiff: What was their actual motivation, and how did they get their unfeasibly large bodies crammed into human-sized skins?

What was the actual reason to suggest Captain Jack was bisexual?

Weak answers would suffice.

ADE

Art

Ooh... likes like CBC are showing it on Christmas day... Score!

Mudcrab

"Weak answers would suffice."

Weak scripts would suffice also, apparently :o)

"What was the actual reason to suggest Captain Jack was bisexual?"

To entrance a female audience. 'Awwww, isn't he lovely, I wish he was my best friend' And this metrosexual crowd, whatever the hell that is.

I won't even try to justify any of the Time Lord stuff, I'd thought much the same.

"Those aliens who keep invading Cardiff: What was their actual motivation"

Cos they're aliens, obviously! That what they do :o)
NEGOTIATION'S OVER!

Mudcrab

But I think the answer is "Yes", so we can praise it and pull it to bits, depending on what seems necessary. I'm just trying not to 'read all about it' on the Beeb website!
NEGOTIATION'S OVER!

Dark Jimbo

Someone else has said what I've been thinking!!

But I think you should watch; you don't have to like it, and at least you'll be in a better position to actually pull it apart later if it's shite.
@jamesfeistdraws

Endjinn

I got some weak answers for you.

"Didn't the Dalek Invasion of Earth follow the collapse of cililisation brought about by the end of a TV news channel, or the proliferation or Reality TV or something? How did that work then?"

They were using the flimsy premise of Lethal Reality TV games to steal people and turn them into Daleks.


"Those aliens who keep invading Cardiff: What was their actual motivation, and how did they get their unfeasibly large bodies crammed into human-sized skins?"

They wanted to nuke the Earth into radioactive chunks and sell it as space fuel. They had some kind of matter compressor things that made them fart a lot.

"What was the actual reason to suggest Captain Jack was bisexual?"

Because those crazy 51st (or whatever century) folks will nail anything - vegetable, animal or mineral. They are the most uber of uber-liberalis.


I never promised they'd be anything other than "weak".

Funt Solo

Oh, come now - if you're going to defeat the Time Lords then the only way to do it is with a Time War.  Do try to keep up!

Of course, it's a paradox.  But then, Doctor Who is a paradox by it's very nature, and always has been. (See also:  Terminator, Judge Dredd and Back To The Future.)  Seems a bit churlish to blame Russell Davies, as he's only joining in a long tradition.

Spending a lot of time somewhere doesn't mean you like it.  I've spent years in Dundee and it's a shithole.

And why does Captain Jack need a reason to be bisexual, anyway?
++ A-Z ++  coma ++

Oddboy

What was the actual reason to suggest Captain Jack was bisexual?


Not so much suggested as fairly blatant: Jack fancies the Doctor more then he fancies Rose - but he'd be up to a dance and/or snogginage with either.
Better set your phaser to stun.

Quirkafleeg


Matt Timson

It always pains me to agree with Gary about anything- but he is correct.

The old Doctor Who was, for the most part, shit.  The new stuff is great and I'm really looking forward to the Chrimbo episode- something I never thought I'd say!
Pffft...

Adrian Bamforth

"Of course, it's a paradox. But then, Doctor Who is a paradox by it's very nature, and always has been. (See also: Terminator, Judge Dredd and Back To The Future.)"

Time travel in my opinion should be treated with caution in fiction in my opinion since it tends to take the gravitas out of the story - anything that happens doesn't really mean much since it might always been undone. The old Doctor Who mostly just used time travel as a fun device to go to different settings without dwelling on the paradox too much, Terminator similarly pulls it off by not hopping around in time willy-nilly. Back To The Future jumps all over the place but it very cleverly written, unlike...

ADE

Funt Solo

"Time travel in my opinion should be treated with caution in fiction in my opinion since..."

Did you, Adrian Bamforth, just experience a hiccup in time?

Spooky, huh?
++ A-Z ++  coma ++

Art

As gary says, Dr Who rocks. And the previous incarnation of it spent most of it's later years as a mangey, wounded creature limping towards oblivion that badly needed to be shot to put it out of it's misery.

Also I suspect Jack is largely bisexual in order to post a future where someone could be  bisexual  without anyone making a big deal out of it.

The Amstor Computer

I'm sure we (the board) went over a lot of this when the series aired earlier this year, but once again:

Should I try and get into the spirit of it and watch the Christmas day episode or avoid like the plague?

Up to you. If you didn't like the first "New Who" series, I doubt you'll appreciate the second. The writers, most of the crew & most of the actors will be the same, so it's very likely to continue in the same vein as the first series.

One complaint I have is of course that none of it (written by Davies) makes any sense

Actually, looking at your questions below it appears it wasn't Davies' writing that didn't make sense - you just don't seem to have paid attention to the episodes you did watch.

Now, surely you can't wipe out Time Lords in a war since by nature they are all over the place in time

IIRC - and I haven't seen the final episode of the series for a while - the Time Lords & the Daleks were wiped out on Gallifrey when the Doctor activated a similar device to the one he contemplates using in "Parting of the Ways". I seem to remember some suggestion that the Time Lords had all returned to defend Gallifrey, but that could be my faulty memory.  

And even so, why should The Doctor be so unhappy, since he can simply go back in time and live with them again?

Aren't the Time Lords supposed to exist outside of time in some way? Even if that isn't the case, the new series makes it clear the "Time War" led to both sides being wiped from the timeline, although other races were still aware of their existence.

Though a few episodes ago there was only one of THEM, left in a museum, now there's millions of them

IIRC, the lone Dalek, the Emperor & the Doctor were the only survivors of the final battle in the Time War. All three were scattered - the Doctor to somewhere unknown (perhaps causing his regeneration), the Dalek soldier to Earth & the Emperor, aboard his ship, to some point outside the solar system. The implication in the series was that the Emperor then spent centuries rebuilding his army - exactly how this was done at first wasn't made clear, but by the time the Doctor discovered the Dalek fleet they were using the humans harvested from the entertainment satellite.

Didn't the Dalek Invasion of Earth follow the collapse of cililisation brought about by the end of a TV news channel, or the proliferation or Reality TV or something? How did that work then?

IIRC, when the Doctor shut down the trasmissions from Satellite Five, he killed Earth's connection to the rest of the universe. It was this sudden blackout that was supposed to have plunged the Earth into a century of turmoil.

The Daleks then appear to have taken control of the satellite - how isn't clear - for use as the GameStation. The events aboard the platform provide them with a steady stream of "winners" and corpses for use as raw genetic material for the creation of new Daleks.

Does The Doctor actually LIKE The Earth? In one episode he describes it as something of an insignificant backwater planet yet he hardly left it for the first series and he adores the work of Dickens

IMO, the Doctor has always had a slightly tetchy relationship with Earth & the human race. It's quite obvious that he loves them, but that doesn't stop him getting frustrated with them for their relative backwardness, aggression etc.

Those aliens who keep invading Cardiff

They actually didn't invade Cardiff - they crashed a spaceship in London. The sole survivor from that story turns up in Cardiff trying to open - IIRC - a dimensional rift to power a vehicle that will send it home.

What was the actual reason to suggest Captain Jack was bisexual?

That he came from a period in the far future where sexuality was a bit more fluid, IIRC.

I'm sure I haven't answered these points quite correctly, but until I get my hands on the box set & rewatch the episodes it's the best I can do.

Art

Some of Ades points are valid - RTD probably isn't the best writer when it comes to the SF aspects, which are generally handled pretty lightly anyway, and he's really got to come up with some ending that don't involve some kind of big shiny Deus Ex Machina. But it still rocks.

(For me Fathers Day was the ropiest as far as time travel elements go, and that wans't even a RTD one)