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Meg 375: Crazy Train

Started by IndigoPrime, 13 August, 2016, 11:41:36 AM

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Colin YNWA

Quote from: Dandontdare on 24 August, 2016, 08:26:44 AM

It doesn't change anything - there's no "newfound indestructibility" it's not "momentous", it's just a peek behind the scenes at what Dredd probably does every few months to keep in shape.


Yep - this does it for me.

Frank

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 24 August, 2016, 06:26:35 PM
Quote from: Dandontdare on 24 August, 2016, 08:26:44 AM
It doesn't change anything - there's no "newfound indestructibility" ...

Yep - this does it for me.

So what exactly does kill Dredd these days? In the last four years, Bullets and artillery shells have ripped so many holes in Dredd that Med Division probably have enough leftover chunks they could build a new Dredd.

Lose an arm, they can regrow it (Logan); lose an eye, get bionics (CotDamned). That only really leaves him vulnerable to brain damage, and even that didn't finish Fargo. Unless Dredd gets killed somewhere other than MC1 (Grindstone Cowboys), he's walking away.

Nobody expects the title character of a strip to die, but until last week there was always the idea a makeover wasn't the kind of thing that would interest Dredd. While lots of weird and outlandish stuff happened around Dredd, he's an island of stoicism and recalcitrance.

There was always the idea that Dredd's refusal to think of himself as anything special would mean infirmity might do what we all know no assassin's bullet ever could. That's what some readers felt was significant and valuable about the unique way Dredd experienced time in the same way as ourselves.

That's no longer the case, and that's fine, but the passing of an aspect of the strip that has been so important and so discussed over the last 30 years felt like it probably warranted more than a so there*.


* As I make clear above, that doesn't mean I wanted the solution to be part of some grand narrative - where Dredd has to take stookie to help him save the city or defeat Judge Death (or something) - just something considered and consistent with the nature of the character and the (recent) tone of the strip.

Reading all that back, I sound like I'm on the verge of tears. I'M FINE WITH ALL OF IT, honest.

Steve Green

Hey, if he can shoot himself in the chest, be killed (and revived) by Nige the Opressor, turn into a zombie and a werewolf and back again, I'm fine with this.

Recent tone? You either want the history and that it's the same character, or you don't.

The weary old Dredd thing worked for a while, but unless you're actually going to kill of the character it starts becoming ridiculous and a bit of a dead end.

Colin YNWA

Quote from: Steve Green on 24 August, 2016, 08:53:27 PM
The weary old Dredd thing worked for a while, but unless you're actually going to kill of the character it starts becoming ridiculous and a bit of a dead end.

Yeah more of this agreeing thing from me. It really worked for a good time but if its not going anyway, while it can't go away push it right to the back I say.

As for all the damage Dredd takes and recovers from - that's comics... not actually that's hero-based genre stuff. The only thing that bugs me is that it again gets a bit tired after a while. Its like its the only way writers feel they have to show Dredd challenged and facing a tough test is too beat the snot out of him. I'm sure some of the great talent writing the character can come up with something else?

Just cos often various writers like to see him pushed to the edge they always keep it on the bounds of creditability...or at least let us suspend disbelief. Its quite clear that if some thing hit Dredd and killed him off he'd be dead, well until Rico brought the Crystal of Snazzwuzz to revive him.

Frank

Quote from: Steve Green on 24 August, 2016, 08:53:27 PM
You either want the history and that it's the same character, or you don't

Again, like everyone else, I'm absolutely fine with the method chosen, which is consistent with the established technology of the strip.

I'll let my explanation above be my last words on the topic because the volume of words I've devoted to this far exceeds the tosses I give. It's settled now and didn't really matter anyway.

I loved the two guns held to Doc Carousel's eye sockets and the high level of gleeful, lusty bloodshed that I haven't previously expected from Carroll but which is rapidly becoming his authorial signature. Willsher's anatomically correct Visible Dredd is great fun too.

We'll have to add this to our list of Times We've Seen Dredd's Face.


EDIT: I'm fine with the damage inflicted on Dredd, Colin. I only mentioned it to illustrate what (I thought) vulnerability to ageing brought to Dredd that was so unique, and therefore valuable

Jim_Campbell

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 24 August, 2016, 09:16:39 PM
As for all the damage Dredd takes and recovers from - that's comics...

Indeed. Let's not forget that he was shot right through the head at the start of 'The Day The Law Died' and was incapacitated for about an episode and a half...
Stupidly Busy Letterer: Samples. | Blog
Less-Awesome-Artist: Scribbles.

TordelBack

Quote from: Steve Green on 24 August, 2016, 08:53:27 PM
The weary old Dredd thing worked for a while, but unless you're actually going to kill of the character it starts becoming ridiculous and a bit of a dead end.

This is a very good point. I'm very bored of the 'weary Dredd' style of non-Wagner strip too, and had rather hoped Titan/Enceladus brought that trope as far as it could go (without killing him). On my ongoing Meg catch-up odyssey, it often seems like we get a geriatric Dredd subplot every second month...

Will Cooling

Quote from: Tordelback on 24 August, 2016, 11:38:49 PM
Quote from: Steve Green on 24 August, 2016, 08:53:27 PM
The weary old Dredd thing worked for a while, but unless you're actually going to kill of the character it starts becoming ridiculous and a bit of a dead end.

This is a very good point. I'm very bored of the 'weary Dredd' style of non-Wagner strip too, and had rather hoped Titan/Enceladus brought that trope as far as it could go (without killing him). On my ongoing Meg catch-up odyssey, it often seems like we get a geriatric Dredd subplot every second month...

This is the one issue we've got with Wagner taking a back seat. Like in the 1990s we've got loads of different writers doing their "Mega-City One is in Danger" stories. Since Day of Chaos we've had Trifecta, Titan and Carroll's stealth epic that have all left Mega-City on the brink of destruction. Wagner was better at varying up the content of his mega-epics.
Formerly WIll@The Nexus

Proudhuff

Given how high security the clinic is and the obviously money spent on the whole project... who were the other senior aging Judges/Justice Dept officials who were shot in their beds? The rest of JD's Academy class?
DDT did a job on me

TordelBack

Quote from: Proudhuff on 26 August, 2016, 02:37:57 PM
who were the other senior aging Judges/Justice Dept officials who were shot in their beds? The rest of JD's Academy class?

Sheesh, Dredd'll be furious. I think he's been trying to shoot the entire class one by one himself for 40 years now.  That'll teach em to wedgie a man in too-tight regulation U's.

Hawkmumbler

Quote from: Tordelback on 26 August, 2016, 05:57:20 PM
Quote from: Proudhuff on 26 August, 2016, 02:37:57 PM
who were the other senior aging Judges/Justice Dept officials who were shot in their beds? The rest of JD's Academy class?

Sheesh, Dredd'll be furious. I think he's been trying to shoot the entire class one by one himself for 40 years now.  That'll teach em to wedgie a man in too-tight regulation U's.
"You still wearing those tight stookie smugglers, Joe?"

sheridan

Quote from: Frank on 23 August, 2016, 06:25:26 PM

No foreskin. Shalom, Joseph.



Two possible responses to that:
a) maybe that's one of the last bits to grow back?
b) if it had already grown back, rabbis in the big Meg are pretty damn efficient!

sheridan

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 20 August, 2016, 11:41:11 AM
Rebooted Strontium Dog wasn't billed as untold tales—it was billed as an accurate account versus the 'hearsay' we'd previously experienced. In reality, this of course meant 'Wagner gets to use his TV script for something', and that first tale in particular seems to sit in a slightly different universe to the rest of Strontium Dog. The computer historian angle seems to have gradually died a death though, with 'new' SD essentially becoming a continuation of the original run.
Of course, if the previous stories are now regarded as hearsay by JW, the Death of the Author critical technique suggests that currently running stories should also be regarded in the same light.
QuoteAs for reboots in general, I'm not against them when they work. Fr1day was fine for that very first run, but then went very wrong when Gibbons departed. And the IDW Rogue was an excellent foundation to my mind. (And this is coming from someone who's not generally a fan of that strip.) I suppose the key is in retaining the spirit of the original (IDW) or creating something with a similar concept that's compiling (Fr1day). The Robo-Hunter stuff by Millar achieved neither (although the Hogan/Hughes run came close).
I loved the War Machine and IDW Rogue, and would favour a continuation of IDW Rogue stories in the prog (like Dredd stories running at the back of the Meg while JD runs at the front).

Millar's Robo-Hunter was a waste of Casanova's art, while I agree that Hogan and Hughes turned in far better work.  I did like Samantha Slade, shame Gibson lost interest (in 2000AD, comics altogether?)

Frank

Quote from: sheridan on 28 August, 2016, 03:22:53 PM
Quote from: Frank on 23 August, 2016, 06:25:26 PM
No foreskin. Shalom, Joseph.

rabbis in the big Meg are pretty damn efficient!

There's an 80% chance Dredd is circumcised, irrespective of whether the Fargo kids took violin lessons on Sunday mornings. The reasons for that are many and various, ranging from capitalism to none at all.

It's essentially a cultural practice, rather than a medical or religious one, so the most reliable predictor of whether a US male is circumcised is whether his father is cut. In Dredd's case, I'm not sure whether that would mean Fargo, Judd, or Wagner.



sheridan

Quote from: Frank on 28 August, 2016, 05:53:19 PM
Quote from: sheridan on 28 August, 2016, 03:22:53 PM
Quote from: Frank on 23 August, 2016, 06:25:26 PM
No foreskin. Shalom, Joseph.

rabbis in the big Meg are pretty damn efficient!

There's an 80% chance Dredd is circumcised, irrespective of whether the Fargo kids took violin lessons on Sunday mornings. The reasons for that are many and various, ranging from capitalism to none at all.

It's essentially a cultural practice, rather than a medical or religious one, so the most reliable predictor of whether a US male is circumcised is whether his father is cut. In Dredd's case, I'm not sure whether that would mean Fargo, Judd, or Wagner.
Or an anonymous geneticist in a cloning lab, circa 2066.